Topic: 94' LWB didn't start this morning. (Read 666 times)

Daniel · « **on:** August 21, 2008, 07:53:11 AM »

This is going to be simple, but is a major problem at the moment.

I bought my 94' RRCLWB for a daily driver. To keep the DII for off-road, and the motorcycle for good weather. During the last two months, the RRC has worked flawlessly. Besides the things which were wrong that I knew about at purchase, nothing popped up. During the last two days of TS Fay plowing through Florida, I've driven it everywhere.
Two days ago, I was plowing through a flooded out street; 16-18 inches of water, nice bow wave, but not enough momentum. It stalled out. I waited about 30 seconds for the water to flatten, and she started first try, and drove right out. For the next hour or so, I was driving through sections of road with 4-12 inches of standing water intermittently. No further problems. Yesterday, I drove her to work. Over the course of the day from 6 am to 6 pm, I started the truck 4 more times, and not once did a problem emerge.

It should be noted that for the last two months, when I turn the key, the engine immediately turns over, within a half second.

This morning, I go out, and nothing. The key turns fine, no resistance. Brake pedal pushes up against my foot, EAS pumps fire right up. Warning lights pop up, just like any other time; but no starter. Not even a solenoid click. Battery has plenty of juice. All electrics work fine. No hesitation on windows, Sunroof, stereo, blowers, or the like. Just no starter.

I even tried starting in both park, and neutral. Foot on brake and off, no difference.

Is there a fuse that could have blown? Or is this most likely one of the key switch problems that occurs on these trucks? Nothing led up to this. When I left work last night, it fired right up, drove perfectly, and I did not go through any standing water on the way home.

the colonel · « **Reply #1 on:** August 21, 2008, 08:02:54 AM »

do you get aux lights on the dash at least?

Daniel · « **Reply #2 on:** August 21, 2008, 08:07:10 AM »

I get everything it normally does. Everything, except no engagement of the starter. And NOTHING led up to it, nothing. Just out of the blue.

the colonel · « **Reply #3 on:** August 21, 2008, 08:31:43 AM »

it may be the back part of the ignition switch...happened to me. thats when donny showed me how to jump start my series. that was the morning of our first meet. i swear they know when to have a tantrum!!!

grobinson · « **Reply #4 on:** August 21, 2008, 09:34:19 AM »

Could it also possibly be the coil? Had to replace that in my '88 RRC when I used to have it.

Texaninmass · « **Reply #5 on:** August 21, 2008, 09:52:53 AM »

To scared of reprisal to answer....

Oh well won't be the first time....turn the key to the on position (One click before engaging the ignition) get a piece of speaker wire.. attach one side to the positive side of the battery..climb under the car and find the post that the ignition wire goes to (Usually the smallest wire at the top of the starter and the hardest to get to)
Touch the wire to that post, if your starter does not engage your problem is at the starter, if it turns over then you have a problem from the wiring back to the ignition switch.
Remember I am ASE Certified....Anthony's Stupid Experience

Tex

boot-it · « **Reply #6 on:** August 21, 2008, 09:57:32 AM »

just ram a large screwdriver between the + and the - on your starter, if it turns over look elsewhere. i got my training same place as Tex

Daniel · « **Reply #7 on:** August 21, 2008, 10:32:36 AM »

No thanks on that way. LOL! I have a Matco remote starter for bypassing things like that. If it comes down to that. I want to find the starter solenoid relay, somewhere on the firewall, and try that first. It won't be a coil keeping the starter from engaging. That would keep it from running though. Starter would still turn over.

junkyddog11 · « **Reply #8 on:** August 21, 2008, 05:59:40 PM »

10$ says the starter is junk or that the connection at the starter is loose or the ignition switch is junk. Those are the 3 most often found faults that lead to the described condition....in that order.

I'd try seeing if the white /red wire at the starter relay has 12v when the key is turned to start if not then suspect the ignition switch. If yes, check the small brown/red at the starter solenoid (you can actually test this at the starter relay also...other side) has 12v when the key is turned to the start position....if it does then the battery 12v is poorly connected or the starter is junk.

Given that it may have something to do with water and wetness being driven through I'd still guess at the starter

Lordwinslow · « **Reply #9 on:** August 22, 2008, 10:15:27 AM »

It was all that water, it cleaned the "gunk" away and that changed the electrical polarity of your vehicle so now it will not start.

Winslow

Daniel · « **Reply #10 on:** August 23, 2008, 12:03:54 PM »

Well, I was wrong in my first post. It ain't easy! I went through every yellow relay in the damn truck, until I found one under the driver's seat, that cliscks when I turn the ignition key to pos. III. Click! Click, click, click. Hold it with my fingers of one hand while turning the key with the other. Can feel it clicking, not just hear it. Must be the starter solnoid relay! Changed it with another to be safe. Same thing. After about 20 cycles, starts getting slightly warm, so it's working. Also the ignition switch must be good, for the signal to get to the relay. Also, net to this relay, under driver's seat, I found my immobiliser switch, and it wasn't popped. So not the Immo., not the ign. switch, and not the relay.

I'm at my shop now to pick up a test light, and a multimeter, along with my remote starter. Will check on Matt's suggestions. Thinking locked up starter after the 1/2 miles at a time through 16-18 inch deep flooded out roads from Fay.

Thanks guys. Will keep everyone up to date.

Lordwinslow · « **Reply #11 on:** August 23, 2008, 02:32:40 PM »

I still liked the screwdriver short test...that sounded like fun...brings back nasty images of 3-Phase power lab in college...

Winslow

junkyddog11 · « **Reply #12 on:** August 23, 2008, 07:58:36 PM »

Thought the starter relay was under the bonnet behind the washer bottle. Silver. Might be thinking about the wrong year though and I don't have shop manuals at home (purposely....my gf would use them to line the cat box or something)

Daniel · « **Reply #13 on:** August 25, 2008, 07:42:07 AM »

It could be. The Rave CD says the starter relay is behind the RH footwell fascia, on a 95, but since that is the only "softdash" year, who knows? I'll check the bonnet location as well. Need to check there for the fuel pump immobiliser as well.

Thing thats killing me right now, is I tested the wires to the starter. Big lug was reading 11.9, same as battery. Small post was cold. Hot when key in pos III. Hooked the remote starter to the small post, and to bat +. Starter whirred right over. But no resistance, like it wasn't touching the flywheel, or something. Starter strong, and good. Starting to lean more and more towards nuetral/park immobiliser switch, but Rave CD doesn't mention how to test it or bypass it. Have to be 100% on the starter solenoid relay location, then do the Rave tests with the test light. Once I go through each one of those, in sequence, I will be a lot closer to definite answer. I agree with Matt, that the relay I found can't be 100% certain, since the wiring colors he gave me I can't find.

Kevin88RRC · « **Reply #14 on:** August 25, 2008, 08:49:36 AM »

I'm almost 100% positive the starter relay for the 94 is under the driver's side dash. Moved in 90 from the engine compartment still the generic metal relay (#5 in the pic). In 95 same location but the relay has yellow top.

I thought the only relays under the driver's seat are the seat relays??? There's the main ECU relay under the passenger's seat that clicks on & off with the key. Was it that one you were messing with?

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